Puma Punku fathered Machu Picchu sites start.

Puma Punku is not far from Machu Picchu and even some of the building techniques are the same. I believe that the expertise and the tools that started many sites in Peru came from the central site of Puma Punku.

Machu Picchu in Peru holds a tremendous secret that few can see. Yet, it is readily apparent in most photographs of the site. Yahoo the site and you can see the photos of the stone work. Can you see what it is??? Think purposeful and 3-dimensional puzzel. The laying of the stones are impossible for ancient man to accomplish unless they were more advanced in engineering than we were some 50 years ago! Unless they already had Brown's Gas, they could not have created this facade. It would also have required laser and computer backup to do prelininary requirements for future stones. Overunity might have been known back then and then was 12,900 years ago or the engineers have visited Earth in the years since. Keyword plyability, was needed in order to "lock" these stones due to the potentiality of earthquakes. The Inca, did not put the base stones down but they did put little stones on top of the highly engineered bases. When the Spanish built their churches on top of the base stones, the earthquakes destroyed them but the old stones still stood easily. Meaning, the ancients were highly advanced.

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red pill junkie's picture
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You sir, like "living on the edge"! ;)

OK, let's start the discussion with arguments: You posit that this site demonstrates the use of a technology similar or higher than our own —lasers, computers, etc. But, can't you consider the possibility that you are seeing this because of your *own* familiarity with lasers & computers?

What if the ancients had technologies that were "oblique" to our own? —i.e. not in accordance with what engineers would deem as "advanced", but that allowed them to produce feats of megalithic construction that we could not replicate with our own technology?

It's not the depth of the rabbit hole that bugs me...
It's all the rabbit SH*T you stumble over on your way down!!!

Red Pill Junkie

Enigmni Freak's picture
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Yes, I would believe that if the evidence indicates, but I am merely stating my contentions as a point-of-departure. For all I know they used their minds to foment constructions there and utilized nano-technology to create such smooth surfaces in uniform parameters. But the fact remains, they created these elementals as we do today in a prefabricated manner. I believe no matter what we arrive at in our discussions, the ancients were much more sophisticated then we have given them credit. The fact that they lived in unison with nature is more advanced in my way of thinking because I could not do that due to the fact that I know little of nature since I have not studied it as much as I have studied Marketing, Advertising, Graphics, Psychology, Business, and a whole bunch of other...stuff.

I love your attitude.

Enigmni Freak's picture
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I recently bought some DVDs from Atlantis Rising that David Hatcher Childress and Christopher Dunn played the leading commentators in. It was called ANCIENT TECHNOLOGY IN PERU AND BOLIVIA and I have to say it was great to find some kindred souls who believe that Advanced Ancients were responsible for the great engineering and stonework of the sites in Peru and Bolivia. It just makes me more determined to continue to write my book and work toward my movie of that book plus a RPG video game to be developed. Our ancient cultures are astonishingly much more appropriate for open-mindedness than any format possible. I firmly believe I am right in my theories on who and what our ancient ancestors were about and what caused them to suffer a gargantuan catastrophe. If it was not the Carolina Bays Event, then it indeed was something like it happening some 12,900 years ago. The evidence is everywhere!

LastLoup's picture
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Question: Do you believe that the ancients came to these technological ends on their own or had outside help from "otherworldly" beings, whether by "aliens" or simply people or whatever of a higher thought from another dimension.

Also, some would say that if they had access to such technology, other than the obvious perfection of their temples, what physical evidence do we have of this genius? Humans are clearly capable of creating amazing things. The underlying principles of building a temple to the sun are no different from building the structure of a European cathedral or a modern day skyscraper. But I must agree that we should give credit to the hands of the ancient stone workers and minds who made them. Something definitely changed in humans after the time of the Great Flood.

"Following the dog’s example, you will have to be wise in sniffing, smelling and estimating these fine and meaty books...after which you should break the bone and suck the substantial marrow..." ~ Rabelais

epgrondine's picture
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Enigmni Freak wrote:

I recently bought some DVDs from Atlantis Rising that David Hatcher Childress and Christopher Dunn played the leading commentators in. It was called ANCIENT TECHNOLOGY IN PERU AND BOLIVIA and I have to say it was great to find some kindred souls who believe that Advanced Ancients were responsible for the great engineering and stonework of the sites in Peru and Bolivia.

EF, Did Steve Zagota include in that video any of Chris Dunn's comments that the ancients may have used large stones because that was the easiest way for them to construct such structures?

Enigmni Freak wrote:

It just makes me more determined to continue to write my book and work toward my movie of that book plus a RPG video game to be developed.

I wonder how you intend to distribute those, EF...

Enigmni Freak wrote:

Our ancient cultures are astonishingly much more appropriate for open-mindedness than any format possible.

Don't try to use anyone's bafflement, amazement, awe, or confusion to try to commit spiritual theft, EF.

Enigmni Freak wrote:

I firmly believe I am right in my theories on who and what our ancient ancestors were about and what caused them to suffer a gargantuan catastrophe. If it was not the Carolina Bays Event, then it indeed was something like it happening some 12,900 years ago. The evidence is everywhere!

EF, I know the mega-tsunami experts who are trying to sort out exactly what, whether impact or other geolgical forces caused tsunami, and when those tsunami occurred. In other words, multiple catastrophes, not just one.

I don't know if they would take the time to come by here and tell you you're full of crap. They may just assume that I can handle it myself.

At least you're no longer claiming that Teotihaucan was destroyed by a nuclear devices.

I hope you will not be too confused by what the peoples remembered about the fate of Puma Punka, which I will post in my next comment on your "hypothesis".

E.P. Grondine
Man and Impact in the Americas

red pill junkie's picture
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I don't know if they would take the time to come by here and tell you you're full of crap. They may just assume that I can handle it myself.

And I just assume you can argue with Enigmni without resorting to insults that are beneath you both.

Otherwise you can rightly assume that I will start deleting such comments.

It's not the depth of the rabbit hole that bugs me...
It's all the rabbit SH*T you stumble over on your way down!!!

Red Pill Junkie

epgrondine's picture
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red pill junkie wrote:

I don't know if they would take the time to come by here and tell you you're full of crap. They may just assume that I can handle it myself.

And I just assume you can argue with Enigmni without resorting to insults that are beneath you both.

Otherwise you can rightly assume that I will start deleting such comments.

In the future I will use a different word for EF's hypothesis.

E.P. Grondine
Man and Impact in the Americas

LastLoup's picture
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Replying to EPGLONDINE:

I realize that you are not fond of any theosophical thought or for that matter anything that EF says, but you really should let it go. You are being childish. He has his thoughts, you have yours.

Pointless....

I am tired of seeing this kind of hatred towards another persons theories and beliefs. You don't have to agree with him or like theosophy or any related subject, but keep your comments to yourself. And you are allowed to post a disagreement, but don't call people out like that. It's not crap, it's thought. It's as strange as "Through the Looking Glass" crossed with a Hieronymus Bosch painting, who cares. It's thoughts like this that gave humans the imagination to succeed and cope with the doldrum life we are stuck with. Would you yell at a child who colored the sky green and the grass blue? Imagination is the founder of theory and the kindred of philosophy. One day EF will be either proven wrong or right and both of you will be dead and buried by then. If you have a problem with this then go, and don't forget to leave a tip for the waitress. That is all.

"Following the dog’s example, you will have to be wise in sniffing, smelling and estimating these fine and meaty books...after which you should break the bone and suck the substantial marrow..." ~ Rabelais

epgrondine's picture
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LastLoup wrote:

It's not crap, it's thought.

If you don't know the difference...

In the future I promise I will use the word "nonsense" if a hypothesis violates the data.

LastLoup wrote:

It's as strange as "Through the Looking Glass" crossed with a Hieronymus Bosch painting, who cares.

Most Andean peoples. These were their ancestors' work, and they resent having them stolen from them.

LastLoup wrote:

It's thoughts like this that gave humans the imagination to succeed and cope with the doldrum life we are stuck with. Would you yell at a child who colored the sky green and the grass blue?

EF is no child.
Perhaps your life is doldrum, my life certainly is not.

LastLoup wrote:

Imagination is the founder of theory and the kindred of philosophy.

Sometimes people try to use philosophy or religion as a replacement for thought. It doesn't work too well.

It's "thoughts" like these that to often lead to suffering.

LastLoup wrote:

One day EF will be either proven wrong or right and both of you will be dead and buried by then.

It's likely to be much, much sooner than that.

LastLoup wrote:

If you have a problem with this then go, and don't forget to leave a tip for the waitress. That is all.

It's not my intention to go anywhere, but here's a tip for EF:
before you ever attempt to comment on comet and asteroid impact, please learn what you are talking about.

And here's a tip for you:
If you think theosophism is a benign belief system, view "Last Secrets of the Axis". Millions dead.

E.P. Grondine
Man and Impact in the Americas

LastLoup's picture
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Whatever, I'm not going to get involved in this petty fighting. I really couldn't give a damn. And yes my life is doldrum, as are the rest of us poor f**ks who have to work minimum wage. Everyday I wish I could escape. It's nice to have a pace like this with people of similar views to talk and discuss pleasantly with. But I will not continue, as I am not as hot headed as I seem. But thank you, nonsense is a "better" word. Also it's not a belief system that is bad, but how people interpret, or rather misinterpret, things that causes death and destruction. Just as with Christianity, Catholicism, and ANY other religion, ever a system such as Theosophy, if it is misinterpreted or purposely altered to fit a particular "evil" desire, then yes any thing bad can happen. I admit I know little on asteroids, but I am learning, please don't take my lack of knowledge for stupidity, just speak and guide, not insult.

Thank You.

"Following the dog’s example, you will have to be wise in sniffing, smelling and estimating these fine and meaty books...after which you should break the bone and suck the substantial marrow..." ~ Rabelais

epgrondine's picture
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No question these gigantic stone constructions are amazing. EF. Just don't let anyone use your amazement to commit spiritual theft.

More later.

E.P. Grondine
Man and Impact in the Americas

red pill junkie's picture
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Remember: I wanna clean fight. No punches below the belt, and you'll go back to your corner when I say so :-P

It's not the depth of the rabbit hole that bugs me...
It's all the rabbit SH*T you stumble over on your way down!!!

Red Pill Junkie

LastLoup's picture
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red pill junkie wrote:

Remember: I wanna clean fight. No punches below the belt, and you'll go back to your corner when I say so :-P

Yes we are still cleaning the blood off the altar from the last 109 brawls you two had.

"Following the dog’s example, you will have to be wise in sniffing, smelling and estimating these fine and meaty books...after which you should break the bone and suck the substantial marrow..." ~ Rabelais

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In view of what I have stumbled upon in my meditations on Puma Punku, the work at Machu Picchu (indeed of all artifacts attributed to the Inca) is much more involved than the silly little plant to which some reference in dissolving stone. If they had a high degree of chemical infrastructure I might believe this. But there is much more to these sites that blows my mind away. I have started to concentrate on what a being would have to do and know intellectually in order to create such works as that of Puma Punku and have determined that they were way beyond our abilities. Their realm must have been so much more highly sophisticated than even our own way of thought.

The leftover creations or sections are so sophisticated in mental conceptualization and engineering not to mention research into realms we do so little study in, are like us looking at a brick through the eyes of savage who is still just foraging for insects to eat. In my mind, I see Predator's daddy.

The artifacts left over by whomever the Puma Punkuans were are absolutely unbelievable. If we found them anywhere today, just laying around as leftovers from one of our building sites we would still be amazed and would wonder who had the mentality to do such fine work and how they did the work. To contemplate upon the tools they used causes one to think about some sort of machine that manifests 3-dimensional or holographic elementals in some sort of Head-mounted display in keeping with preformed specifications and then just converting them into a physical state from that point, not unlike our computers do with graphics. It seems like a from of Photoshop only in 3-d and extruded into reality via Nanotechnological means. It is like the utilization of DNA-like abilities in a different format to manifest things. I think of the system associated with the Sefirah of the Sefirot being the manipulation of Da'at. It is a technology we have not yet become aware of and have not explored it much. It reminds me of a form of Overunity.

This site is indeed a SILVER BULLET to our views of history and who and where those ancient builders were from. We should all be in awe at the engineering that apparently was involved in their environment. By projection to consider the tools they utilized to make these pieces boggles the mind. I am reevaluating my very consideration/s of who and what we are as beings occupying these forms here in Time/Space! It is time to move the scale of our being/becoming up and out to higher levels.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pumapunku

Long ago I took several courses in this necessary knowledge for development of the artifacts of Puma Punku. I was the top of my class of 90 students, but it was not easy and such knowledge was inherent within the archaeology found at this site. There is so much insinuated by the end-products here that it boggles the mind. Let us keep expanding on this little post and see if we can bring to life the potential of Puma Punku's contributions.

red pill junkie's picture
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It seems like a from of Photoshop only in 3-d and extruded into reality via Nanotechnological means. It is like the utilization of DNA-like abilities in a different format to manifest things

If they had such a technology, then why would they bother to build things using blocks of stone? Wouldn't it be easier to build edifices and temples made of a single piece of rock, if they are just manifesting things?

I do a lot of modeling with AutoCad. The limit to what you can do in the software's virtual space is the user's imagination; the troubling part is when you want to bring your masterpieces into reality! then you have to figure out how to build things using smaller components that you will join somehow. How easy my life would be if I could just manifest things directly from the computer! then I would make chairs and beds and desks out of a single piece :)

It's not the depth of the rabbit hole that bugs me...
It's all the rabbit SH*T you stumble over on your way down!!!

Red Pill Junkie

Enigmni Freak's picture
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red pill junkie wrote:

It seems like a from of Photoshop only in 3-d and extruded into reality via Nanotechnological means. It is like the utilization of DNA-like abilities in a different format to manifest things

If they had such a technology, then why would they bother to build things using blocks of stone? Wouldn't it be easier to build edifices and temples made of a single piece of rock, if they are just manifesting things?

I do a lot of modeling with AutoCad. The limit to what you can do in the software's virtual space is the user's imagination; the troubling part is when you want to bring your masterpieces into reality! then you have to figure out how to build things using smaller components that you will join somehow. How easy my life would be if I could just manifest things directly from the computer! then I would make chairs and beds and desks out of a single piece :)

I know whereof you speak, I once was headed to being an engineer and an architect. I taught Auto-cad just 3 years ago prior to retiring. I really think that the civilizations that once ranged this Earth were very different from us. I do not think that technology was pervasive as we enjoy, I think it was utilized for designated purposes and they were less materialistic than are we today, I believe they knew the evils of what we are impacted by at present. Our behavior is indeed hedonistic and evil. They were genetic experts and knew how to live with Nature more-so than we. The philosophical evidence speaks volumes when one understands the underlying behavior/s of the Vedics, Jomon and other anciently oriented cultures. They literally loved how nature works and it filtered through to their examples of todays offspring.

What is left of their cultures are buried under the oceans and mudslides. A tsunami two miles high swept the earth and probably more than once. The buildings at Puma Punku were overwhelmed as evidenced by their current positions. They had to take to the skys and a few made it to Machu Picchu.

LastLoup's picture
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UGH!!! You made me have a CAD memory! I remember spending hours and hours after school trying to catch up on projects they only gave us 45 minutes per class time to finish things. I'm amazed I got out of that class with a passing grade. Too much math!!! It burns ;)

"Following the dog’s example, you will have to be wise in sniffing, smelling and estimating these fine and meaty books...after which you should break the bone and suck the substantial marrow..." ~ Rabelais

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Final Cut Express promises to be the moving version of Photoshop. I believe the ancients had something like this localized in a select organization of engineers who went all around the earth building sites for dissemination of knowledge and wisdom. The Masons are an example of their former selves. It just did not work well enough to re-school humanity after some great past catastrophe that destroyed the infrastructure that once held this planet together as a uniform culture. I think that Puma Punku was an outpost of scientists who worked the genetic realms in agriculture and development. They realized that something was about to happen and they took to the sky and went to Machu Picchu to survive. It was perfect to survive the tsunami that was to wash the earth clean and bury all those ancient organizations that once were spread about the entire earth.

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The gains in Nanotechnology are exponential these days and with the advent of Over-unity concepts, we just may be able to make some great leaps in the next 20 years. I believe that if we continue down this road, we will indeed make a jump to the point where we can utilize the mathematics inherent in RPGs and create a new realm for entities to vacation within. Not unlike some past movies we have been watching since we were children. Manifestation is multifaceted.

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EVENTS IN SOUTH AMERICA:
THE FALL OF PUKARA AT LAKE TITICACA

Fragments of Comet Encke may also have impacted in South America. The account of the Pukara impact given here is that of Cristobal De Molina de Cuzco, from his Fables and Rites of the Incas, 1575. Writing some 20 years after Betanzos (Chapter 9), at the request of Francisco de Toledo, the fourth Viceroy of Peru, Molina’s creation account differs in many particulars from that of Betanzos. Its importance here lies in that Molina places an impact at Pucura (Pukara), which is located in the basin of Lake Titicaca.

“'The Indians also have another myth in which they say that the Creator [Con Ticci Viracocha] had two sons, one of whom they called Imaymana Viracocha, and the other Tocapo Viracocha...

“'These Indians also believed that neither the Creator [Con Ticci Viracocha] nor his sons [Imaymana Viracocha and Tocapo Viracocha] were born of woman and that they were unchanging and eternal. The various tribes of this country have many other nonsensical beliefs and fables about their origin insomuch that if we were to record them all, it would be very prolix and there would be no end to it...”

“...In the same myth they also say that at Tiahuanaco, where he [Con Ticci Viracocha] created the tribes of men, he created all the different kinds of birds, male and female of each, giving them the songs which each kind was to sing. Those that were to inhabit the forests he sent to the forests and those which were to inhabit the highlands to the highlands, each to the region proper to its kind. He also created all the different species of animals, male and female of each, and all the snakes and creeping things there are in the land and commanded each to its proper habitat. And he taught the people the names and properties of the birds and snakes and other reptiles.

“The Creator [Con Ticci Viracocha], who they say was the father of Imaymana Viracocha and Tocapo Viracocha, commanded Imaymana Viracocha, the elder of his two sons, in whose power all things are placed, to set out from that place [Pucara or Tiahuanaco ?] and traverse all the world by the road of the mountains and forested valleys. As he [Imaymana Viracocha] went he was to give names to all the trees large and small, to the flowers and fruit they were to bear, and to indicate to the people which were edible and which not, and which [of them] had medicinal properties. He [Imaymana Viracocha] also gave names to the herbs and flowers, and the time when they were to produce flowers and fruits, and taught people which could cure, and which would kill.

“His other son named Tocapo Viracocha, which in their language means "the Maker", he [Con Ticci Viracocha] ordered to go by the road of the plains, visiting the peoples, and giving names to the rivers and trees, and instructing them as to the fruits and flowers. And thus they went to the lowest parts of this land until they came to the sea, where they ascended into the sky after having finished making all that there is in the land....

“...When the Creator had fashioned the peoples and nations, giving to each their appropriate appearance and language, and had sent the Sun, the Moon, and the stars to their places in the sky from Tiahuanaco, the Creator, whom the Indians in their own language call Pachayachachic [Teacher of the World] or [Con] Ticci Viracocha, which means the Unknowable God, went along the highland road and visited the tribes to see how they had begun to multiply and to fulfill the commandments he had given them.

“Finding that some tribes had rebelled against his commands, he changed a large part of them into stones in the shape of men and women with the same costume that they had worn. The changing into stone occurred at the following places: in Tiahuanaco, in Pucara and Jauja, where they say he turned the huaca called Huarivilca into stone, and in Pachacamac, in Cajamarca, and other regions. Indeed today there are huge figures of stone in these places, some of them almost the size of giants, which must have been fashioned by human hands in times of great antiquity. And as the memory failed, and in the absence of writing, they invented this legend saying that the people were turned into stones by command of the Creator on account of disobeying his commands.

“They also say that at Pucara, which is forty leagues from Cuzco on the Collao [Collo-Suyu] road, fire came down from heaven and burnt a great part of them, while those who tried to escape were turned into stone."

With Pukara crippled, the stage was set for the rise of Tiahuanaco (Tiwanaku) in the Lake Titicaca basin and the creation of the magnificent stone structures whose remains are found there today.

COMET ENCKE AND THE MAYA:
THE INSCRIPTIONS AT PALENQUE

K'an Hoy Chitam (now read as K'an Joy Chitam) was ruling at Palenque during this appearance of Comet Encke and the catastrophic climate collapse which it produced, and the later king K'inich Ahkal Mo' Nahb' III (that’s The Third) left us some account of how K'an Hoy Chitam handled the situation:

“On Seven Ajaw, the Eighth of K'anasiy, there are seven stones.
The 'okib' of Yax 'Itsam 'At, the Tun Lord, is fashioned.
K'an Hoy Chitam, the Holy Lord of Palenque, casts incense upon it.”

“Itzam”, the cometary serpent, had once again appeared – so K'an Hoy Chitam had an “okib” made and dedicated, accompanied, one can be sure, with plenty of human sacrifices. While this account is brief enough, what is even more interesting is why K'inich Ahkal Mo' Nahb' III remembered the events of his predecessor of some 200 years earlier. According to account given by the historian Bede, right square in the middle of K'inich Ahkal Mo' Nahb' The Third’s reign, another two comets appeared, which were scaring the hell out of everyone:

“In the year of our Lord 729, two comets appeared around the sun, striking terror into all who saw them. One comet rose early and preceded the sun, while the other followed the setting sun at evening, seeming to portend awful calamity to east and west alike. Or else, since one comet was the precursor of the day and the other of night, they indicated that mankind was menaced by evils at both times. They appeared in the month of January, and remained visible for about a fortnight, pointing their fiery torches northward as though to set the welkin aflame...”

The Maya were scared as well. K'inich Ahkal Mo' Nahb' III provides us with a Mayan tale of these comets, featuring G1, the First Maize Revealer Partitioner (Impactor), G2, the Sun Eyed Torch, the Killer of Kings, and G3, the Red Dwarf Partitioner.

“No days, no winals, thirteen years, and eight k'atuns later
Four Ajaw the Thirteenth of Yax Zihom, is the stone-seating
It is the fifteenth K'atun,
It is the stone-binding of K'inich Ahkal Mo' Nahb' [the third], the Holy Lord of Palenque.
It is the first carrying(?) of G1, the Zalaj B'olon .

“Sixteen days, seven winals and two years later
Then Nine Kib' the Nineteenth of K'anasiy comes to pass.
The fire enters into the Eight House [...], the Fire [...] House.
It is the red [...] house of G1.

“Twenty-four days later
Seven Ajaw, the Third of Wayab', is the rope-taking(?).
It is his [...]
It is the carrying(?) of Zalaj B'olon.

“Seventeen days, six winals and two years later
It is Six Kaban the Fifth of Yaxk'in .
It is the fire entering.
The Three-Skull Bone ... is the red ... house of G2.
The Great Sun .. House is the red ... house of G3.

“Three days and two winals later
It is Ten 'Ajaw the Eighth of Ik'-Zihom.
It is the First Five Stones.
The 'okib' of 'Aj ... [event missing]
It is in the presence of Aj Chit [...] G1
K'inich Ahkal Mo' Nab' [the third], the Holy Lord of Palenque, casts upon it.”

It is clear that King K'inich Ahkal Mo' Nab' The Third wanted to assure his subjects that he had done all the things required of a king to prevent those comets from killing them. That’s one of the big reasons for all of the inscriptions in the first place.

EVENTS IN THE VALLEY OF MEXICO:
THE FALL OF TEOTIHUACA

Around the year 650 CE, another people arrived in the Valley of Mexico, conquered the city of Teotihuaca, established their control there, and began their own raids into the Mayan lands.

The new rulers of the Valley of Mexico were the Toltec, and once again their cultural traditions are quite distinct, this time both from those of the Maya and from those of the Teotihaucans. Once again, these people's language is different (Nonoalca), and they appear without nearby cultural antecedent. My guess, and let me emphasize that this is merely a guess, is that these people may have also emigrated via large watercraft from the west coast of South America, and that their appearance in Mexico may be related to the disappearance of the Moche people from the coastal region of South America around 650 CE.

This time, we at least have materials relating to that movement, specifically The Annals of the Cakquichiquels, and what must be a very late pictographic version of the same, The Codex Borgia. The close parallels between these peoples and the Vikings in Europe appear quite striking to me, and so I note a few of them here. Watercraft played a role in these peoples' attacks, as may be seen by the boat depicted on the 10th page of The Codex Borgia. In much the same way that the Vikings used dogs in their attacks, these people heaved containers of bees at their opponents, and this may be seen on the 8th page of the Codex. While I have not spotted a clear scene of this in the late Codex Borgia version, The Annals of the Cakquichels also relate these peoples’ use of the bow and arrow, and this may be indicative of South American roots. The appearance of this new weapon would bear parallel with the Viking's introduction of the battle-axe in Europe.

THE COLLAPSE OF THE CLASSIC MAYA

Those looking for catastrophic ecological reasons for the collapse of the "Classic" Maya would do well to examine Linda Schele's work The Code of Kings, where she outlined the effects of this Toltec population movement. The conquest of Teotihuacan by the Toltecs touched off a final devastating round of wars between those Mayan city-states which had been under Teotihaucan influence and those Mayan city-states which had not.

On the other hand, perhaps those looking for a catastrophic reason should not abandon hope. If the Toltec were in fact Moche immigrants, then it appears likely that the original Moche immigration from South America had been touched off by an earthquake which destroyed their irrigation systems.

E.P. Grondine
Man and Impact in the Americas

Enigmni Freak's picture
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Linda works hard but there are many gaps...

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Last activity:
9 weeks 7 min

I have read this all before and have relatives who also corroborate much of the above. It is not new. I have also received this information via meditation and in a much more amplified version. Good stuff. As it is late, I will retire and evaluate the new information that I have received as of recent.